Comments on: Challenge for Today’s Church Leaders http://lofitribe.com/challenge-for-church-leaders/ A compendium of writing concerning progressive community, literature, culture and faith by Shawn Anthony. Thu, 11 Mar 2010 18:14:08 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.9.2 hourly 1 By: Shawn http://lofitribe.com/challenge-for-church-leaders/#comment-21442 Shawn Wed, 11 Mar 2009 18:59:39 +0000 http://www.lofitribe.com/?p=1953#comment-21442 Great verse, Nathan. Thanks! Great verse, Nathan. Thanks!

]]> By: Shawn http://lofitribe.com/challenge-for-church-leaders/#comment-21441 Shawn Wed, 11 Mar 2009 18:59:18 +0000 http://www.lofitribe.com/?p=1953#comment-21441 Hey, Ben. It may just turn out to be a very good thing! You may be right! Hey, Ben. It may just turn out to be a very good thing! You may be right!

]]> By: Shawn http://lofitribe.com/challenge-for-church-leaders/#comment-21440 Shawn Wed, 11 Mar 2009 18:58:17 +0000 http://www.lofitribe.com/?p=1953#comment-21440 Thank you, Jason. I must admit, however, whatever it is you are trying to say in this and previous comments, is not clear to me. What are you trying to say? Thank you, Jason. I must admit, however, whatever it is you are trying to say in this and previous comments, is not clear to me. What are you trying to say?

]]> By: Jason Dolinski http://lofitribe.com/challenge-for-church-leaders/#comment-21436 Jason Dolinski Wed, 11 Mar 2009 12:41:15 +0000 http://www.lofitribe.com/?p=1953#comment-21436 Don't forget that if the Bible is not the main source of these teachings and not what we want the bible to say that all the growth in the world will be nothing but a resounding Gong. Piety and spirituality have been wasted on causes that were not even biblical because a pastor with good intentions had an axe to grind. Thanks, Jason Don’t forget that if the Bible is not the main source of these teachings and not what we want the bible to say that all the growth in the world will be nothing but a resounding Gong.
Piety and spirituality have been wasted on causes that were not even biblical because a pastor with good intentions had an axe to grind.

Thanks,
Jason

]]> By: Ben http://lofitribe.com/challenge-for-church-leaders/#comment-21434 Ben Wed, 11 Mar 2009 06:16:51 +0000 http://www.lofitribe.com/?p=1953#comment-21434 Hey Shawn, I believe Siggy has introduced us a couple times. I've been reading your blog for awhile but this post really hit me and I finally decided to comment ;) Great points throughout and a lot of really good, tough questions to struggle and pray through. In my humble opinion, the 'death' of 'Evangelical Christianity' (as we call it) will be perhaps one of the best things to happen for the good of the Church in years. The 'Americanization' (read: materialism, idolatrous patriotism and non-questioning acceptance of modern consumer culture) of Christianity is mainly to be blamed on this branch of our faith. (Although, we are all far more guilty of this than we like to admit). It's much easier to say than endure, but the 'intolerance' towards Christianity by the powers that be may be exactly what we need. Jesus refers to the Kingdom of God like a mustard seed. It is an often overlooked fact that for a mustard seed to release the spice held inside, it must be crushed. The early church grew like wildfire on the underside of the empire precisely because so many people could see that they really meant and believed what they said. It would be crazy to keep being a Christian if they didn't. Who wants to die for something they don't believe in? While I in no way hope for the outright (especially violent) persecution of Christians, I do believe that the more we are the outcastes that Jesus once created a movement out of, the closer we will be to the Kingdom. It has been too easy to be a Christian in recent years. It was never meant to be easy, and when it is, it becomes luke warm and unauthentic. I think that is what people are searching for today: Something that is real, authentic, dirty, and vibrant. Something completely its own; That defines you first, before anything else, whether it be biological family or nationality. In fact, something that makes those first two things meaningless in comparison. Something that you are either crazy for following, or crazy to be missing out on, but nothing in between. Let's embrace our eccentricity. Hey Shawn,
I believe Siggy has introduced us a couple times. I’ve been reading your blog for awhile but this post really hit me and I finally decided to comment ;) Great points throughout and a lot of really good, tough questions to struggle and pray through. In my humble opinion, the ‘death’ of ‘Evangelical Christianity’ (as we call it) will be perhaps one of the best things to happen for the good of the Church in years. The ‘Americanization’ (read: materialism, idolatrous patriotism and non-questioning acceptance of modern consumer culture) of Christianity is mainly to be blamed on this branch of our faith. (Although, we are all far more guilty of this than we like to admit).

It’s much easier to say than endure, but the ‘intolerance’ towards Christianity by the powers that be may be exactly what we need. Jesus refers to the Kingdom of God like a mustard seed. It is an often overlooked fact that for a mustard seed to release the spice held inside, it must be crushed. The early church grew like wildfire on the underside of the empire precisely because so many people could see that they really meant and believed what they said. It would be crazy to keep being a Christian if they didn’t. Who wants to die for something they don’t believe in?
While I in no way hope for the outright (especially violent) persecution of Christians, I do believe that the more we are the outcastes that Jesus once created a movement out of, the closer we will be to the Kingdom.
It has been too easy to be a Christian in recent years. It was never meant to be easy, and when it is, it becomes luke warm and unauthentic. I think that is what people are searching for today: Something that is real, authentic, dirty, and vibrant. Something completely its own; That defines you first, before anything else, whether it be biological family or nationality. In fact, something that makes those first two things meaningless in comparison. Something that you are either crazy for following, or crazy to be missing out on, but nothing in between.
Let’s embrace our eccentricity.

]]> By: Aaron Mayeski http://lofitribe.com/challenge-for-church-leaders/#comment-21433 Aaron Mayeski Wed, 11 Mar 2009 05:55:56 +0000 http://www.lofitribe.com/?p=1953#comment-21433 I meant I also liked the article! I meant I also liked the article!

]]> By: Aaron Mayeski http://lofitribe.com/challenge-for-church-leaders/#comment-21432 Aaron Mayeski Wed, 11 Mar 2009 05:54:03 +0000 http://www.lofitribe.com/?p=1953#comment-21432 Great stuff, I did not the article in the Christian Science Monitor too. I actually do hope the modern day Evangelical movement either totally reforms or disappears from its current form and function. The segregation, money, culture and education wars need to stop as we slowly incorporate ourselves back into modern culture in order to be a quiet voice of reason rather than a obnoxious chant of xenophobia and hate. Exciting times, I am happy to be a part of them! :) Great stuff, I did not the article in the Christian Science Monitor too. I actually do hope the modern day Evangelical movement either totally reforms or disappears from its current form and function. The segregation, money, culture and education wars need to stop as we slowly incorporate ourselves back into modern culture in order to be a quiet voice of reason rather than a obnoxious chant of xenophobia and hate. Exciting times, I am happy to be a part of them! :)

]]> By: Nathan http://lofitribe.com/challenge-for-church-leaders/#comment-21431 Nathan Tue, 10 Mar 2009 22:55:00 +0000 http://www.lofitribe.com/?p=1953#comment-21431 One verse that kept coming to mind while reading your post is Jeremiah 6:16. This verse constantly rings true to me whenever the dialogue concerning church maturation, growth, problems, etc etc. comes up. One verse that kept coming to mind while reading your post is Jeremiah 6:16. This verse constantly rings true to me whenever the dialogue concerning church maturation, growth, problems, etc etc. comes up.

]]> By: Jason Dolinski http://lofitribe.com/challenge-for-church-leaders/#comment-21430 Jason Dolinski Tue, 10 Mar 2009 18:46:00 +0000 http://www.lofitribe.com/?p=1953#comment-21430 I must admit that I have been following you on twitter for a while and like many things that you have said, but there is still a concern in the back of my mind that I must air here briefly. The issue with much of the relevant stuff that is out there is that it missing a basis. Much of what you said is true on the onset, but has little or no foundation. That being said there is a quick and easy way to fix a lot of the issues that you speak of. If we as Christians (from whichever denomination) were to do this one thing our numbers would become meaningless.(Just as a clarification I am not speaking about anything supernatural or cooky) Now the issue with this one thing is that it is very simple. It is so simple that many overlook it for more complicated things. Quote"Today’s leaders need to fight the easy temptation to offer people a full-service faith built upon lowest-common-denominator living and instead challenge congregations with the invitation to the tension that accompanies - this tension always has been and always will be - the Incarnation" Todays leaders need to stop leading and start teaching how to fish (and I am not speaking of missions, but missions would be an outflow of the one thing). The issue with much of the leadership as well as many other institutions is that we grave self preservation. But this one thing doesn't guarantee that. You noted :"Truly, we should be working ourselves out of a job (but then again, that would require us to actually trust God, and why would a church leader do that?!" This one thing (and no the Sunday School answer "Jesus" is not what i mean) will do that, but it isn't popular and it doesn't sell that well, for all I know you might be doing it already, I don't know you that well. Be blessed and continue to strive the one thing is not as allusive as it could be, but in your article you don't even mention it. Sincerely, Jason Dolinski Twitter name :Dolinski I must admit that I have been following you on twitter for a while and like many things that you have said, but there is still a concern in the back of my mind that I must air here briefly.
The issue with much of the relevant stuff that is out there is that it missing a basis. Much of what you said is true on the onset, but has little or no foundation. That being said there is a quick and easy way to fix a lot of the issues that you speak of.
If we as Christians (from whichever denomination) were to do this one thing our numbers would become meaningless.(Just as a clarification I am not speaking about anything supernatural or cooky) Now the issue with this one thing is that it is very simple. It is so simple that many overlook it for more complicated things.

Quote”Today’s leaders need to fight the easy temptation to offer people a full-service faith built upon lowest-common-denominator living and instead challenge congregations with the invitation to the tension that accompanies – this tension always has been and always will be – the Incarnation”

Todays leaders need to stop leading and start teaching how to fish (and I am not speaking of missions, but missions would be an outflow of the one thing). The issue with much of the leadership as well as many other institutions is that we grave self preservation. But this one thing doesn’t guarantee that.

You noted :”Truly, we should be working ourselves out of a job (but then again, that would require us to actually trust God, and why would a church leader do that?!”

This one thing (and no the Sunday School answer “Jesus” is not what i mean) will do that, but it isn’t popular and it doesn’t sell that well, for all I know you might be doing it already, I don’t know you that well.

Be blessed and continue to strive the one thing is not as allusive as it could be, but in your article you don’t even mention it.

Sincerely,
Jason Dolinski
Twitter name :Dolinski

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